Episode 782 - Sensei Craig Wharem
Sensei Craig Wharem is a Martial Arts practitioner, instructor, Managing Director at Karate International, and author at Martial Journal.
When I was younger and I went to a friend’s house, and that friend has a younger sibling and didn’t have a friend over, the younger sibling was going to play with us whether my friend likes it or not. That was how it’s gong to roll because nobody should be left out. That mentality just always carried over for me… So when I started teaching, it’s important that every single student felt that…
Sensei Craig Wharem - Episode 782
whistlekick isn’t run by one person and this podcast isn’t a one-man show. One of the people who helps whistlekick is Sensei Craig Wharem. Sensei Wharem has been on the show numerous times but he hasn’t been a “guest” of the show. Sensei Craig Wharem started his journey when he realized that he wasn’t the most athletic growing up and the rest was history. He is currently Managing Director at Karate International and author at Martial Journal.
In this episode, Sensei Craig Wharem talks about his journey as a martial artist, what it’s like growing up, his passion for making people around him better, and more!
Show notes
You may check out Sensei Craig Wharem on Martial Journal
Show Transcript
Craig Wharem:
We could just call it conversations with Craig. That should be this episode.
Jeremy Lesniak:
We've done conversations episodes. I've done that with a few people, but that's when I have somebody back on and we're talking about subjects and we're not talking about them. And I wanna talk about you.
Craig Wharem:
Fair.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Because we don't really talk about you when you're on.
Craig Wharem:
That's true. Normally it's...
Jeremy Lesniak:
You're what? 14, 15 times you've been on? We've not talked about you.
Craig Wharem:
It's been pro wrestling or Roadhouse.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's everything else.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
But we're doing it and we're doing it in the same room which is kind of fun.
Craig Wharem:
That is fun
Jeremy Lesniak:
I'm trying to think of the last time I recorded with someone in person. It's been a long time. Yeah. It's been a really long time.
Craig Wharem:
It's also fun. Is that like the New Hampshire headquarters of whistlekick?
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right.
Craig Wharem:
Your bedroom's right over there.
Jeremy Lesniak:
My bedroom is over there.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
For the audience, if you don't know, I spend a lot of time with this guy, right? Why am I looking there? I should be looking there. Whether it's the MATTC teacher training stuff that we work on together. Really, I mean, you are either directly or quietly involved in almost everything that happens at whistlekick.
Craig Wharem:
Pretty much in one iteration or another.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah. At worst, your feedback. At least your feedback on that.
Craig Wharem:
Sometimes my feedback's the worst, so it's fine. I'm also involved in projects of whistlekick's future.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Things we don't talk about yet.
Craig Wharem:
We can't even discuss.
Jeremy Lesniak:
You and I can't even discuss them. They're so new.
Craig Wharem:
And cause sometimes when I do that you go bald.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah, that's true.
Craig Wharem:
Sorry. That brings me back the first time we met. You came down to the school and, you know, I wasn't really sure like I didn't know how this was gonna be, right? You never really know. And you came in, we kind of did like the bro hug that every martial artist does, right? And then the first thing you said was, I am so jealous of your hair. And after that I was like, okay, this is gonna be fine. We're gonna make this work.
Jeremy Lesniak:
We'll be alright.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
That was six and a half years ago.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. That's crazy.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's nuts to think I've known you that long.
Craig Wharem:
And at the same time that's all like, that's the only length of time.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
It feels like it's been a lot longer.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's true. So I know it is probably rare I sit down to do this with someone and know this much about their journey. I know a lot about your journey and so this is gonna be a challenge for me in not assuming things, right?
Craig Wharem:
Sure.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's usually pretty easy to me. And to the audience, if you don't know this about me, I don't prep for interviews. And I do that intentionally because if I prep, I'm assuming information and I'm assuming information with my questions and my follow-ups, my responses that the audience doesn't have. And so I have never seen my role as an interviewer to get to certain kinds of information. It's to facilitate the conversation and to encourage the guests to share their story the way that they wanna share it. You listen to a lot of the shows, so I'm gonna ask you instead, where do you wanna start?
Craig Wharem:
It's funny cause the challenge that I have is I have told so many stories on other episodes that I was struggling, when we decided we were finally gonna sit down and do this, I was struggling to think of stories that I hadn't already shared in one episode or another.
Jeremy Lesniak:
You don't have to do it that way.
Craig Wharem:
No, but it was the way I wanted to tackle it a little bit because those stories, realistically, as I was thinking about it, in every episode, if you just listen to the ones I'm in, you get a gist of the story on its surface level. If you hear all those stories I tell. Which to me said, okay, we'll go a little deeper, which is fine.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Sure.
Craig Wharem:
And I'm a fairly open book about pretty much everything. There's not much that I withhold.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I'm probably more filtered on this than you are.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
With your episode. Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah, probably. Well, I learned at one point and I don't know exactly when I learned it, but when you have hardships in your life or struggles and we'll get into them, but when you have those, if you only ever look at them as a hardship or a struggle, then that's what they'll always be. And they'll always be something that can be used against you at some point. And if you wield them and talk about them, then it's a little bit more like armor. Like it keeps you safe in a way. Which in fact, I can't do the exact quote, but one of my favorite books, when I was in high school, was Game of Thrones. And one of the characters, Tyrion Lannister, says that at one point in the book, he's a smaller person and he calls himself that. You know, in many different derogatory fashions.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right.
Craig Wharem:
And when someone asks him, he said, the world acknowledges what you are and if you own it and you have confidence in that, then you'll be okay. And it becomes a shield which is true. So, yeah, we can delve a little deeper today and stuff and I think it'll be fun.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay. You started at?
Craig Wharem:
11 . Yeah, I was 11.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Why?
Craig Wharem:
Because I was the worst athlete on the planet.
Jeremy Lesniak:
But what about being a bad athlete makes you say, oh, I'm gonna go do this thing where if I'm a bad athlete, I get kicked in the face?
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. Well, I didn't know.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Oh, Kempo so punch in the face.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah, yeah, Kempo. We wait till they go lower. My brother was a varsity football player. My sister was really good at drama and I kind of struggled a little bit with figuring out what my niche was. Before martial arts, my hobbies were sitting in my underwear watching movies, and eating lucky charms like that was what I did.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Well, there wasn't a lot of time before 11, so, you know, be fair to yourself.
Craig Wharem:
Fair but...
Jeremy Lesniak:
And you know, it also doesn't sound like a bad way to spend a day once in a while.
Craig Wharem:
Once in a while. Not every day though. A good example of the highlight of my little league career.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
This is the most excellent. I love the story. My brother is 14 years older than me.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
He's in the Air Force. He meets a woman. He brings her back to meet the family. Again, my brother's a varsity athlete so he wants to see his younger brother playing little league. He didn't know that my dad became a coach on the team because then I wouldn't have a choice and had to go to the game, right? So he didn't know that I couldn't stand playing baseball, soccer, nothing. I didn't like any of it. And he brought my future sister-in-law to the game and I'm playing left field and I'm standing out there and I yelled to her, her name's Nicole. I said, Nicole in the middle of the inning, somebody's at bat. And I yelled in order to the concession stand and asked her to pick it up for me.
Jeremy Lesniak:
How old are you?
Craig Wharem:
Probably at that point, probably eight or nine. And she's like, Craig, aren't you supposed to be playing? And I yelled, no, don't worry about, they don't hit the ball this far anyway. Can you get me a pretzel and a red Gatorade and Big League Chew? And that was that. But that...
Jeremy Lesniak:
That's such a you thing. Such a good story.
Craig Wharem:
I probably would still do that at, you know, free training day Northeast.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
But I didn't have any emotional investment in what I was doing.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I'm gonna... keep talking while I tape the camera down a little bit.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. Because I didn't care so much about what was happening. And where I ended up going Karate International. A friend of mine, a very good friend that I had since kindergarten had been training there actively. And he invited me to buddy week and to come and be his friend at karate class and I never went.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Why?
Craig Wharem:
Because you had to do pushups.I knew I wasn't good at it and it became a barrier. And it was a barrier until I was 11. I was in sixth grade and I walked into my PE class and John English, my instructor, and my boss today, one of my best friends, he was teaching at that school.
Jeremy Lesniak:
He was teaching martial arts at the...
Craig Wharem:
Right, for the week he was there, he was in a gi and he taught it. And the first technique he ever shared was a wrist grab escape. Somebody's grabbing a wrist, how to break that grab. So I did it. I thought it was cool and my mom picked me up from school that day cause I didn't always ride the bus home. And we were driving and as we were about to turn onto the road that we lived on, I said, oh mom, that's a karate school. The guy taught in PE today. I really liked it. I think I might wanna do it. She quickly floored it into the parking lot of the karate school and signed me up that day.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
She did not give me a chance.
Jeremy Lesniak:
What do you think was going on? I'm guessing you know the answer, you've talked to her about it at some point. What made her do that? Doesn't sound like she even asked you questions?
Craig Wharem:
No, it was just we're going. And I think what it was, and again, like athletic things and things like that ran in the family, my dad and my mom were both varsity sports and athletes. My dad was a musician, played trumpet and played drums, and a few other things. And I had not found...
Jeremy Lesniak:
It was the first athletic or even physical thing you'd expressed interest in.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And she wasn't gonna let that opportunity pass.
Craig Wharem:
Right.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
And so we pulled in, we get there, I walk in the door, I do the orientation lesson, get the white belt. He said, come back tomorrow for the first class. Sure, no problem. My stepdad brings me the next day and I see all of a sudden a bunch of kids that are in middle school and in high school out on the mat. And I turned and looked at him and I went, we're wrong time. This is my class. It was very clearly my class, but I was getting nervous about it. And as I turned to walk out the door, John caught me and he was like, Craig, it's good to see you. He put his arm around me, and I don't wanna use the word dragged, but I certainly didn't have any choice but to walk onto the mat.
Jeremy Lesniak:
He knew what was going on. He saw that you were nervous.
Craig Wharem:
Yep. And after reading my childhood application that my mother filled out about me, that she never thought I'd see, it was clear he was waiting for me.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Are there bits in there you're willing to share?
Craig Wharem:
Oh yeah. Yeah. I scored, I had a 10, I think I scored a 5 in confidence. Does your child have any physical considerations we should know? She wrote not very flexible or fast, you know, which, you know, was all fair. Like she didn't write anything that was groundbreaking, right? Like it was all stuff I knew. But it was cool in the way that looking back, he had read that he acknowledged it and he knew. So he was watching the door waiting for me for a reason cause he knew I would turn around and leave. And then after that, There were some times where maybe I thought I was gonna quit, you know, being 13, 14.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
But he always seemed prepared for those. And in two weeks, it'll mark 20 years since I walked in and he caught me trying to leave. Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay. Now, you know that probably my favorite question and audience, this goes long before the show started, is why? I love to know why, why did people start? We covered that, but the question that I've been most fascinated with over probably the last two years is why did you continue? And, you know, as a martial arts instructor, plenty of people start, most of them don't continue.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right? Wherever you're gonna draw that line, there's no finish, but most people don't make it a year. Why did you continue when it seems like you got a lot stacked against you and you were barely cresting a threshold to even get started.
Craig Wharem:
Right.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And you sound like a prime candidate to not continue.
Craig Wharem:
Sure. I can't pinpoint why. A year and two years in, I still didn't like doing pushups, right? Like I still didn't like the physical component.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Did you like the other show? You like training? Did you like kata? Did you like...
Craig Wharem:
No.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
Right. What it boiled down to to me at the beginning was it was a social thing. I had met a week or two into my training, there was a kid who was in the same English class as me. And we became friends because of karate. Like we saw each other at karate, we saw each other in English class.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yep.
Craig Wharem:
Then all of a sudden another kid had signed up. We had science class together, whatever it was. And all of a sudden I started to make these social connections. And my older brother being 14 years older in the Air Force, not around, in fact, my first day I had met someone who was, you know, I think he's about five years older than me, I don't remember anymore, and he kind of like took me under his wing, you know? Like he was already a black belt, he was teaching that class, but he recognized in me something. And so in the times where I was discouraged learning a kata, learning whatever, he would take it upon himself to give me as much time extra as I needed and as much praise as I needed because I was already critiquing myself enough. And so it wasn't a love of fighting, it wasn't a love of grappling or striking or kata. It was just I liked the environment.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's almost everything, but the stuff that we think of people wanting to train. Now, I think I know the answer to this question and that's why I'm asking [00:14:00] it. Were you social in school? Did you get along with people?
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. One of the longest-running jokes, and I don't attribute this very much to my martial arts because I was a pretty social person and I was pretty aware of bullying that happened unless it happened to me. In elementary school, I was bullied, right? And it took me years to realize that I was. But I had a problem whenever I saw somebody being picked on or bullied like I didn't like it, and I would go outta my way to either, you could either A, confront the bully and get them to stop, or b, you could show the person being bullied compassion and empathy and be with them in a way and become friends with them. My parents always used to joke that my friend group was the island of misfit toys. Right? Like, I would find all the social outcasts and they became my friends. They were my friend group, but I also could be friends with the quarterback and I also could be friends with the musicians. And like, I just had that way where I was open, willing, and accepted enough to just be friends with everyone. My martial arts did play into that a little bit as I became into high school. Physical confrontations happened. I was not afraid to be in one to protect somebody who needed to.
Jeremy Lesniak:
We've talked about some of those stories.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. Yeah. So, the pro wrestling episode, there's a story in there.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay. So at some point, you know, cause if we're talking about 11 continuing high school, the only things that we've really contextualized in a positive way are the social environment, the engagement, the connection you had with others. But we've, we've kind of already spoiled the end of the story in that you are running a martial arts school. Something changed somewhere along the line that made you go from, this is kind of a thing I do and I like hanging out with people to this is my job and in a sense my life. Where did that flip?
Craig Wharem:
When I was a kid, I wanted to teach, I always wanted to be a teacher.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
I was fascinated with making others better. Seventh grade we had a talent show and I didn't want give a talent, but I wanted to run the show. I wanted to put on the best show possible for everyone else to showcase their talent. Same thing in high school, I was very fortunate, I had one of those teachers, you know, that makes indelible mark. Her name was Ms. Pat she was the chorus director. I love music. I didn't wanna work hard to learn how to play piano. I didn't wanna learn music theory. I could sing and I could perform. You know, I'm pretty out there.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
Right. So, it's, I'm able to perform in any way I need to. But I became fascinated with the production side of a show. So she recognized that and knew that I was in chorus. I was being graded to sing, right? But she knew that my interests were making the programs, like making, what songs are we singing, lighting the show, doing the sound work. And I became graded on that. I was no longer graded on singing in high school. I stopped performing my sophomore year and I spent chorus concerts at the sound and light boards. And I was graded on that instead, which was really cool for me because I could do the other stuff that everyone else was doing. But I was much more interested in this kid's really talented, I wanna make them better.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And that fed into fast forward from 11 to 13. When I started helping at the karate school teaching. I was able to pull out of people a little bit more to make them better. And part of that is because again, I was willing to delve deep. I was willing to go, what is holding you up here? Like, let's meet you where you're at and make you a step better. And, there were people along the way who did that for me. There's a lot of mentors I've had, but it was.
Jeremy Lesniak:
You got some of them on the show.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah, a lot of them. If I start namedropping, there's gonna be a lot of episode links, folks. I can't do it. But we were able to, or I was able to find a way to pull out of people what they needed. So.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Were you aware of that at the time?
Craig Wharem:
Yes.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Or is it okay?
Craig Wharem:
Yeah, I've always been aware of that and I've always been told to the credit of the adults around me when I was younger. If I went to a friend's house and they had a younger sibling and the younger sibling didn't have a friend over, the younger sibling was gonna play with us. Like, that was how it was gonna roll, whether my friend liked it or not because they shouldn't be left out. And so that mentality just always carried over for me. And when I started teaching, it was important for me that every single student felt that. And that's not always the easiest, but to me, the only way I can do it, and feel good about myself at the end of the day. Like I, I need to know that I did everything I can. Does that mean that I helped them? Well, hopefully, and it took a long time for me to be mature enough to know that I can't help everyone. But one of the mentalities I have and had about 10 years ago, this really started to come up. I was shocked by a statistic that my boss told me, and he said it at a banquet. We were giving speeches and he said, 98% of the students that I've taught in the 25 years or whatever it was at the time, that he had been running a school. 98% of those students never got into a physical fight. That wasn't a consensual fight, meaning you're at a tournament or you're whatever.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
They had never and 100% of them have felt some sort of stressor or something that they needed to persevere through that we teach in the martial arts. And so I took that to heart and it, I realized very quickly that for me it wasn't always about being the best fighter. And it's the biggest fight happens between your ears, right? Like that's where that everybody's gonna have that fight. Not everybody's gonna step into a ring or a cage, or not everybody's gonna get into a fistfight on the street, but everybody's gonna encounter some sort of hardship. And that's kind of where I focused and have focused all of my effort in the martial arts. One of my instructors, Professor Lysak, Walt Lysak says everybody wants to be a black belt at active combat. Nobody wants to be a black belt in averting combat, right? And when he said that to me, it brought true a story that I don't think I've told on the show.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
I've always believed because I was never the fastest, I was never the strongest. I was never the best technically, but I always felt like I was a little bit more clever. Like, I was always able to, because I could pull from people what their skill was, whether it was a training partner or whatever. I knew what they could do. And so sparring, I always got beat, but I always put up a good fight. Not always. Sometimes I put up a good, not sometimes once in a while I put up a good fight. But I was, I knew what they could do. And so there was a student of mine. Who I was teaching. I was a senior at this point, in high school. And I had been teaching this kid for a while and his older brother was a freshman and his older brother was in the music program. So I knew I got to know his older brother a little bit. His older brother was having a tough time, and their mom had reached out to me at one point and said, Hey, he doesn't train, but you know, I know you know karate, I know that you guys are all a family over there, you know? And I said, oh, yeah, like introduce him to like, have him come introduce himself to me so I know who he is.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And he did. And then we got to talk and we became buddies and friends. And he had confided in me at one point during spirit week. So this was early in the school year that this kid was sending him threatening messages on an instant messenger. I'm gonna beat you up. I'm gonna kick your butt. Like all that sort of stuff. And this kid was really nervous about it cause he wasn't comfortable in conflict like martial artists are. So he sent me a message on instant messenger right on AOL. And he said, hey Craig, I don't know what to do. Like this kid's gonna beat me up before school tomorrow in the cafeteria like he says he is gonna hurt me. And I said, okay. I said, all right, give me a minute. Let me think about it. I'll give you a call. So, it was superhero day the next day and I said, I have an idea. Just come see me in the morning. Find me in the cafeteria right when you get there. I will not be hard to find. He said, okay. I called Mr. English and I said, sir, there's a problem going on. I'd like your permission to wear my gi to school tomorrow. And he goes, why? I say spirit week. I kind of fibbed a little bit. I was like, it's hero week and martial arts is my thing and you're my hero, you know? Like I did this whole bit. And he goes, yeah, sure, that's fine. I go, okay, cool, thank you. And I called every other Karate International student and I said, wear your gi to school tomorrow. Come confine in the cafeteria. So it spreads out throughout the school. Everyone who goes to Karate Internationals go wear their gi tomorrow. They're gonna confine Craig in the cafeteria. This kid walk...
Jeremy Lesniak:
How old are you at this point?
Craig Wharem:
Senior, I'm probably 16.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
16. I graduated when I was 17, so 16, 17, right in there. So, and I said, I had the kid come up and find us. There were 48 people in Karate International uniforms in the cafeteria, all standing with me. And I looked at the kid, I said, hey, we want you to be part of our crew. We want you to feel that you're part of us. And I saw the kid, he pointed him out. And the kid had started walking towards him. And then when my buddy walked over to me, we put a gi on him. And we had him stand with us. And all of a sudden the bully never gave him a hard time again.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
At the time, I never realized that that was overt in the conflict. It was more like me sending a message like, fine, you can hit him, but you gotta hit me first. And if you're gonna hit me first, then you're gonna have to hit the person behind me next and so on. But it became a cool illustration for me and that something I still say to my students to this day, as a martial arts, you don't ever have to be the biggest or strongest and toughest, but you should strive to be the most clever and think your way out of that situation. And that kind of creative thinking, I think is really, I say it's a benefit of the martial arts and it's probably my biggest takeaway.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Was that nurtured in you or did it simply expose something that was already there?
Craig Wharem:
I think a little bit of both.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem:
It was definitely already there. Again, I ordered food in left field, right? Like that clearly takes not the normal...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah. That's not a standard approach.
Craig Wharem:
Right? But the other thing was when Mr. English heard about it, he pulled me in the office and told me how proud he was that A, I stood up for someone who was part of the dojo family, but B I did it in a way that was not common. And honestly, I feel like that stuck with him a little bit. When the time came for me to graduate high school, and he knew I wanted to teach and I was a social butterfly, so my grades weren't probably where they should have been. And he offered me the job to stick around after high school.
Jeremy Lesniak:
What was that job? What did he invite you to do?
Craig Wharem:
I was the facility coordinator which meant I was the janitor.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Okay.
Craig Wharem: At that time it was a huge facility. We weren't just a martial arts school. We had a 24-hour gym. We had fitness classes. So I got to be the facility coordinator meaning that I had to clean every single piece of equipment, the showers, everything. And I was the Tots Program coordinator, so I was responsible for four to six-year-olds. Because at this point I still had not earned my black belt. I had been training from 11 to 17 at that point, and I still, I was a brown belt. So it took me eight and a half years to get a black belt. So in that time, he said, well, I can't have this guy running classes for older kids, but four to six-year-olds at our school, you could get a quote black belt in that class, meaning that you've mass, you know, you've learned all the basics that that class has to offer, but it makes you an equivalent in the other age of a yellow belt. And then you work your way up to junior black which would then become an adult black as you continue. So, I was responsible for promoting marketing and teaching the four to six-year-olds. And then keeping the facility orderly and maintained. And that's...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Sounds like a lot of work.
Craig Wharem:
It was. It was a lot of work. The way that it was structured was we had somebody in charge of the adults, somebody in charge of the teenagers, somebody in charge of the elementary school, and someone in charge of the little ones which is me. And we all worked together like department heads and we would help each other out. I'd go teach an elementary school class or vice versa, they'd come and teach for me. And I had 30 students. There were 34 to six-year-olds when I took over that program in August of 2009. And I remember very quickly we sat down in September and Mr. Stringer said, you know, where are you gonna end the year? What is your goal? The person who was in charge of the older kids, you know, the elementary school, middle school kids, he said, you know, I'm gonna have 20 more students and we'll do these events and that's where I wanna be. And I looked at Mr. English, I said, I'm not doing any events. I don't want to. And he kind of looked at me like, well, you're not gonna get off that easy, buddy. You don't just get to teach a 30-minute class a day and call it. And I said, but we have 30, we're gonna have 60. I'm gonna double it by December 31st. And he kind of looked at me and laughed because, before me, he had run that program, but he ran all the programs.
Jeremy Lesniak:
So he knew what you were doing. He knew the ups and downs.
Craig Wharem:
And he knew that it was probably not gonna happen, right? Like 30 new students in that short amount of time for somebody who's never done it before. Who wasn't even a black belt, you know, no chance.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
Right. Like, again, like walking in the first day, the cards are stacked, not in my favor.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right.
Craig Wharem:
December 31st, we had 61.
Jeremy Lesniak:
How'd you do that?
Craig Wharem:
Sheer beginner's luck because I've never been able to do it again. No, I went around. Again, I was 18 and I had all the time in the world because it was all I did was that class. So I was in daycares all day, I was talking to people, I was asked, I was getting referrals cause I was doing such a great job. And ultimately, it came down to for a long time when I was just in charge of that class, it would be 24-year-olds and me. And I could get them all to stay in one spot for 30 minutes without moving. And like that was just, I found my stride with that. And then as things changed and the guy who had the older kids program wanted to get married, have a family and wanted to be home at dinnertime, which is perfectly reasonable.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Makes sense.
Craig Wharem:
He left. Then my role kind of expanded and then it expanded again into managing the day-to-day of the school I started in.
Jeremy Lesniak:
So what I'm hearing, if we go back, and this is kind of consistent with what I know about you, there wasn't a specific goal, but there was a general direction and a variety of people at various times helped you course correct. You know, course music I wanna teach. Why don't you run sound and lights? Organizationally, and structurally, administratively. Okay, so now you're doing that. And you're around in the school clearly John saw something in you. Your instructor saw something in you despite, and I'm sure most of the audience knows this is not a disparaging comment, but at that point, six-ish years, you're probably a little bit behind the curve on who's receiving a black belt in your school, right? So if we were to from a big step back say who is the most likely person to become the one running this school and helping it succeed from a distance that wasn't you.
Craig Wharem:
No.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right? You didn't love it. You didn't start at a young age. You didn't thrive in the physical culture. You didn't earn your black belt faster than others. You didn't come out saying, I wanna do this, I wanna teach martial arts. But you had this general direction, and the common thread is around helping people, wanting to help people succeed, wanting to get the best out of them. We've had John on the show and I don't make interview episodes about other people, so I'm gonna ask you to speculate. You may have had some conversations with him. Why did he offer you that job, that first job?
Craig Wharem:
We have talked about it and the funny tongue-in-cheek answer he gave the first time was I said, and I asked them on one of those surreal moments of my life where this guy was my childhood hero and my mentor, you know, I don't know that we've talked about on the show. My parents were divorced, and I'm very blessed in that. They got divorced when I was three, but from all accounts, from everyone who knows them, they are better as friends than they were as spouses. And I had very supportive social circle with my family. But my dad lived an hour away. He wasn't always around. He was a police chief. He couldn't always necessarily be there right then. If I needed him, he was an hour away. It took an hour.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right.
Craig Wharem:
Right. John was always 10 minutes up the road, right? And that is something that has carried over into adulthood, but it goes both ways. Now, he calls me if he needs me and I call him. But at one point we needed to buy new floor mats for the karate school and we bought them and the shipping was a lot. So he called me one Thursday morning and said, hey, I need you to go with me to pick up the floor mats. I'll pick you up tonight. I said, okay, where are we going? He goes, Wisconsin or Minnesota. So we drove to Minnesota. So we had plenty of time to talk. And I said, John, I said, did you ever really think that you'd be driving to Minnesota picking up floor mats with me when I started all those years ago? And he said, no, I thought you would've quit. But then he also said that he wasn't surprised that I didn't. And I said, but I never really stood out. Like there were people who I used to train with one kid won first place in every division at one of the small tournaments we went to in a sling. He competed with commas. He broke with his elbow that was in the sling cause it was his collarbone that was broken. And he, like, this kid was incredible and like went on to become, I'm pretty sure he's a brain surgeon. He's definitely a surgeon. I'm pretty sure he's a brain surgeon. Like that was who I was training with. And John said you were training with such an incredible talent pool that you may not have ever been at the top, but even at the bottom of that talent pool, you still were good. And I'm always self-deprecating about my martial arts, right? And you know, if you've ever been with me, you've heard me say, I don't kick people in the head. I'm not a kicker. I can, right? Like I'm more skilled than I let on most of the time. But he said the thing that always stuck out about me is that you didn't quit and you tried hard, you know. And so the long-running joke I always say is I was just too dumb to quit. Like, I just kept going. Like, I just, quitting never really struck me once I started teaching.
Jeremy Lesniak:
But what was it that he, what do you think he saw? And if we don't have the answer, I may dig the answer up, but why did he give you that job?
Craig Wharem:
The only other thing I can think of that he said to me was that you were always a kid I could partner with anyone and I know they'd be okay.
Jeremy Lesniak:
He trusted you.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Which I'm trying to think of the timing of this episode coming out versus the one we recorded yesterday with the group. We did an episode on friendship in the martial arts which is either gonna be out just before or just after this. I think it comes out before. And in that episode, we talked about the importance of trust. And I suspect, you know, anybody who's run a martial arts school knows that if you want to grow, the biggest challenge, the biggest hurdle is staff you can trust. And he saw something in you that seemed trustworthy. And you know, I can piece together these little bits. You're talking about what you did for this kid at school who was being bullied like this, that that's not only is that a creative solution to a problem, that's a martial arts instructor waiting to happen, right? Like, okay, I recognize this resource I have in this family. I'm gonna band everyone together. We're gonna bring you in. We're gonna keep you safe in a non-violent way. And when we add all those things together, if I look at you through John's eyes at that time, it makes sense. Especially if he was aware that you had a general direction, but not a specific goal. Because how many people graduate high school and they, I think I might want to do something with art or, you know, I like putting stuff together. And 20 years later because the wrong people, or a lack of the right people contributing, they end up, you're like, oh, I had a feeling you would be more, you would do more. You wanted more. Whether he was trying to keep you close or keep you away from, I don't know that it matters, but you kept going. Was it different for you teaching those things that you didn't so much enjoy doing yourself?
Craig Wharem:
I learned to love, right? Like, I learned to love what I do. Did I love everything that he does as a martial artist? No. But again, I'm blessed and, you know, we don't have to always keep it the John episode, but most of everything I have is because of John. In my personal life, in my professional life.
Jeremy Lesniak:
He's an important figure and I think trying to talk about you without at least acknowledging him would be quite difficult.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. I didn't always love what he asked me to teach, but I respected him enough to trust his judgment and he respected me enough to hear me when I had a conflict. And I said, I really, I don't enjoy teaching this. He would say, he would either say, let's find a way to make you enjoy it or deal with it. It's important, right? And you just have to trust me. And he rarely pulled that card. So when he would pull that card...
Jeremy Lesniak:
You listened.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah, I would always respect his opinion. And what happened was the more he and I worked together, now at this point, when we're talking right now, it's been 13, almost 14 years of me full-time working for him.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
We've hit a stride where it's a partnership. Where he has allowed us and allowed me to put things in the curriculum that our students learn that he simply doesn't know. Like he cannot coach them in the way that I can.
Jeremy Lesniak: Right.
Craig Wharem:
You know, I have a black belt in Kung Fu. John did Kung Fu for like three seminars, right? Like, he can't teach or do that, or when I'm doing the Cali, right? Like John's never done that. So he's just gonna trust that I've got it and the infrastructure's in place to make it happen and vice versa. There are parts of the curriculum where I give that it's not my favorite but I agree with John. I see its importance. I understand and I trust that he knows that and I teach it. The most important part of that is our students never know our personal preference, right? Because for example, he and I, we could not be more polar opposite, right? He loves the combat sports. He loves getting into the ring and that sort of thing.
Jeremy Lesniak:
If you haven't watched, well, listen, it would be listen. if you haven't listened to Don English's episode which I'll make sure that we link. He and I spent some time talking about his love of MMA and refereeing at a very high level.
Craig Wharem:
Yes, yes. Yeah. And I love forms. And that was something I grew to love. If you forced me to pick something that I love, when I was in high school or middle school, it would've been probably forms or just the more traditional techniques that Kempo has a million of, right? But those things were always I liked more cause they were a little bit more honor in the culture, the lineage, and the legacy of the art. And to me that was something that was interesting to me. So he and I also paired well in that way. John sees the value in forms and wants them in the curriculum. Does he love them to go to such a deep extent that I do? No. So Craig's gonna be the forms teacher, right? He brought in an outside instructor, a friend of mine named Joe to teach me weapons cause John wanted us to be able to offer more weapons cause kids wanted to learn it. And John said, it's not my thing, it's not what I love. Craig, I want you to learn all of this weapon stuff. I have like 13 bow staff forms, you know. He brought me to Joe, he brought me to other instructors who would teach me these things and allowed me to share with the students cause he knew that that's what I loved. So it was a student and teacher role that became a Boston employee role that became just a true friendship. But I'm fortunate to say that for most of my martial arts career from 20 years ago to now, that's pretty much always how it's gone. You know, it's been that way a lot where I've been fortunate to have mentors around me that have more experience, that are willing to bring me to another level and meet me where I'm at. And like you said it earlier, they kind of channel the direction where I go because I just go. When I walked in the door to do martial arts, black belt was never even on my radar. I did not care.
Jeremy Lesniak:
That's still not really one of your top motivations, right?
Craig Wharem:
True. A majority of the time I don't even put a belt on or a uniform on when I teach because it becomes a barrier sometimes in a lot of ways. I struggle with rank and I struggle with that part of what we do because it warps what we do in such an odd way. In my experience, what I've seen, it can be done really well and it can be done really not well. And there's that duality and I just choose not to participate. Right? Like I just ...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah, we've had a lot of conversations about that and stuff we're certainly not gonna get into publicly.
Craig Wharem:
Right. Yeah. But I just, a lot of times I think the only year, free training at Northeast I've presented a fair amount of times, the only year I wore my gi and my belt was the first year. And then after that I just kind of showed up and whatever I was wearing that day is what I taught in. And I found something really interesting in that experience for me because I was a younger guy the first time, you know. I was in my early twenties the first time I presented and shared a free training day and that was a big deal for me. I was like, I made it. I'm on this big event. Like, this is so cool.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's not a big event.
Craig Wharem:
It felt like it. It was the first time I had to drive to a different state to teach at an event. So it was a big deal for me. And I was more nervous putting the black belt on to present and share.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Why?
Craig Wharem:
I think because everybody has a different definition of what that signifies. And at some point, it goes like, at some point you weren't going to fall down on whatever that is. The same idea as if you read a book and then you see the movie. The movie is never as good because you have it in your head, this is what I want it to be. And I found when I started just not even wearing the belt, not even just walking out in a sweatshirt and karate pants or sometimes when I do seminars, I tell people to wear street clothes. It completely removes that barrier.
Jeremy Lesniak:
It becomes about what you're teaching, not who is teaching.
Craig Wharem:
Right. And it also removes the idea, and again, I mentioned it in the friends episode, but it removes the idea that I am in some way better. The only difference between me and someone who walks in my school, the first day is that I've been there longer. That's the only difference, right? Honestly, a lot of times they go in the front door and they don't try to leave right after they walk in the front door. And I did, right? So they're jumping that hurdle and rank can be that way where it's like, oh, they have this many stripes. I, I'm a yellow belt. I can't even ask 'em a question cause I'm so intimidated. And when that goes away like it did at free training this past Northeast, I had a young kid, teenager come up to me and started asking me questions and I watched her actively look down to check my belt and it wasn't there. And right when she saw that, I watched her shoulders relax and she went, can I ask you some questions? And so it removed that barrier.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Interesting. Yeah. We've had some good conversations about rank and I've been pretty open over the course of the show that I think rank in what we do is going to change. I'm not claiming to know what that is, but I think what you're doing is an interesting example of you're acknowledging it more as a credential rather than rank, right? It's more the certificate is on the wall as your college certificate would be, or this certification would be rather than constantly on you reminding people of that credential. Because I would imagine, well, I don't have to imagine cause we've had these conversations, you know you're a good teacher. You don't need to remind people here's my belt, here's my stripes. I know I'm a good teacher with it or without it on. And I think the part that I find most interesting that I'm hoping the audience will contemplate is what you're describing as a removal of a barrier. You know, we've always said on this show that the goal is to get you to think, not to tell you what to think or how to think. Just to think. So the thing that I'm going to be thinking about that I hope the audience will consider thinking about is have there been times when I'm wearing my belt that I'm creating that barrier? There are times where my relationship to whistlekick in this show is a barrier when I meet people. You know, I've taught and had people, it sounds so ridiculous for me to say, but it's true. And in fact, she knows who she is cause it happened a few months ago, I couldn't get this woman to relax in a seminar I was teaching. Her shoulders like cranked up around her shoulders and her shoulder cranked up around her ears. Relax, relax. I was just so excited to meet you. So that's a barrier. And I'm gonna think about that. So that's interesting.
Craig Wharem:
I found there's two ways to lean into that. I told you a story of, you know, and I can tell a modified version, it loses some of its pizzazz. Last week, I had to pop into the middle school. I'm a well known figure in my area. I'm well known by schools, teachers, you know, police officers, the government, like everyone knows who I am. And part of that is because my dad was a police chief and a high ranking police chief. So a lot of police officers know me because of my dad, but either which way, I walked into the middle school to talk to the teacher. And one kid saw me in the cafeteria and he started shrieking with joy, right. He's like, holy cow, that's the karate guy. And he screamed it in such a way...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Some gentle censorship occurring which I appreciate.
Craig Wharem:
Yes. Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
You can fill in as you see fit.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. As a picture of seventh or eighth grade boy, then you'll understand what was censored. And the superintendent of the school was right there, and he turned and looked at me and I looked at him. I go, at least they like me. And then I just walked away, right? There is that ability where it becomes a barrier because you are the whistlekick guy, right? Or I'm the karate guy in town, but I also often lean into it a little bit and I use that to give them that positive message which is which. So it can be a barrier or a bridge depending on how you use it. But in my experience, oftentimes rank and that sort of thing can become a barrier more than it can become a bridge.
Jeremy Lesniak:
I've got a question for you that I don't think I've ever asked on this show, and I don't know the answer, so I'm curious.
Craig Wharem:
I'm excited.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And this kind of parallels the same journey in a bit of a microcosm of your martial arts, you know. Why did you get started? Why did you remain? Why do you continue to remain? So that same sort of question around your involvement with whistlekick. Because, you know, I cannot overstate your willingness to help every time I ask you to. You know, I think the audience knows that we're still a small company, we're still a growing company, but if I was to add up the hours that you've put in, it's considerable. And I suspect it's not about me and our friendship.
Craig Wharem:
No, cause I was all in on whistlekick before we became friends. Because my gut says so, right? Like we've kind of talked about it already. I just go in the direction that feels like the way I'm supposed to go. And through the people I've met at whistlekick, through the people I've met with you and the things we've been able to accomplish together, not just in whistlekick, but for KI with me, or personally through our training, you know. You and I just working out together once in a while. The things that we've been able to accomplish as a team is what keeps me going on and moving. And the message connect to educate and entertain, I love connecting people. Clearly as a teacher, I love educating.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And I'm a pretty entertaining fellow, right?
Jeremy Lesniak:
I will plus one that, yeah.
Craig Wharem:
So it just kind of lined up in a way that made sense and what's been really fun for me. Cause I don't know, I wasn't as in the know as a I am now, but I wanna say I was pretty close to right at the get go. Not like day one, but in the first couple years I started.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah, definitely the first two years. And I think, you know, our connection, our initial connection was right about the one year mark.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
So you found the show early, you were one of the first people that found the show.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah. So it's been fun for me to watch it grow and have a life of its own. And in that way, the best way for me to describe it is I feel like if whistlekick's your kid, I feel like the proud uncle, right? Like I feel like I've been there.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah. I think that's a pretty solid analogy.
Craig Wharem:
This year was my fifth year of Free Training Day Northeast presenting. You know, everything we do with MATTC, which I'm sure we can chat about, you know, a little bit cause that's important. The Never Settle Awards, you know, everything. Not to drop everything, right? But everything that we've been able to work on together, it feels like a big thing. And when you get to be a part of something that feels like a big thing, that's what matters. Cause there will come a day where I'm not teaching anymore. Whether that's cause I choose to hang the belt up and retire or because I'm gone, right? There will come a day where that's gone.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And one of the things that has always been instilled in me is teachers plant seeds. And we foster that growth as long as we are able, but teachers never get to see the fruit of their labor. And that means a lot of things because, for example, I have some students whom a lot of the people listening will know that I've had for, oh, you know, 15, 16 years. And I still don't feel like I've seen the fruit of that labor yet.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
I'm still planting more seeds. And there will come a time where I'm not there and that's when that growth will happen. And that's a little bit of what whistlekick feels like to me. We're building this framework and planting these seeds for the next generation of martial artists. Because one of the things that is a pet peeve of mine is when people talk about the good old days and that martial arts was so much better. You know, 30, 40 years ago, 50 years ago, whatever, 10 years ago, I don't care, right? Martial arts was so much better back then. Well then we've all failed now just by the way that works. If it was better then, and it's worse now, we failed. And that A, failure is unacceptable to me. It's an inevitability, but that doesn't mean I have to embrace it, right? And B, I have seen a change. I'm young enough to still be one of the young guys. But I've been teaching long enough to be one of the old guys. Right. I've been teaching martial arts since 2005. Over half my life, I've been teaching. And so I know that there's a difference between a student I had in 2005 that walks in the door and a student who walks in the door today. There's a huge difference. But there's a difference in the way that we teach and we educate and we support. And what I know is that as long as we keep doing what we're doing at whistlekick, we keep doing what we're doing through MATTC, I keep doing what I'm doing at KI, that our best days aren't even close to behind us. They're not even on the horizon yet. They're gonna happen long after I'm done doing whatever I'm doing or I failed. And I already told you, I have an aversion to that.
Jeremy Lesniak:
We're on the same page, which is why we keep working together on things. So before we wind down here, let's throw some attention to the things that you work on. You know, kind of in the same way that we might do it in the outro, but we'll do it a little bit differently. So you keep mentioning MATTC. Obviously I know what it is. Some of the audience does, but all of them may not. You know, start with the acronym, what does it stand for?
Craig Wharem:
Martial Arts Teacher Training and Certification. The word that bothers me the most is just. I'm just a karate instructor. I'm just a Taekwondo instructor. I can't, I'm just. Well, perhaps, but to your students you are an important and valued member of their life and to families you can be that. And it really struck me as I had a lot of conversations with school teachers that the content is different. Maybe some of the methodology is different, but the art of teaching. Meaning what comes from your heart? That compassion, that care, and that empathy that is still at its core of anyone who chooses to teach something. The science of teaching and memory retention and that sort of thing, all of those things are essentially the same. Now, through MATTC, that is the hope, right? The goal and the hope is that we are able to help make you feel like an educator. I think the best feedback I've gotten in the times we've run it so far, my favorite feedback I've gotten is someone walked in who has done martial arts just as long as I have, but was on a considerably different path than me. Did not have the people around them lifting them up. And they walked up to me after and I said, did you feel like you got something from this? Do you feel like it was a valuable use of your time? And they said yes, because I realized I'm a teacher. And to me that was the only feedback I ever needed. Now we've gotten amazing stuff, otherwise.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
You know, one of my instructors, Mark Warner, he's got an episode. Episode blah blah, right? I can't do the numbers. But we were fortunate enough to be able to work with this whole team and to watch him talk to me with so much pride about how amazing they're doing is an amazing thing. And to be able to do and replicate what I've been able to do at my own school matters.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
You know, I've had students with mental health issues come up to me. I've had parents come to me to ask how do we tell our child we're getting divorced, you know? And the first time a parent asked me that, I was 19, but they saw this 19 year old kid and said, we trust his opinion. We value his opinion. Now that being said, I stay in my lane. I don't give medical advice. Right? At my school, I have a list of counselors and therapists that I refer people to. I have a list of doctors and nutritionists if people need them. I have those things. I'm not saying that I allow everyone to come ask me questions and I'm the guru who gives all answers, but sometimes people just need to be heard.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And if through MATTC we can help people, we can help martial arts feel heard, that's worth it to me. Because the biggest opponents we have, and this is honestly how I approach my kata, it's how I approach conflict, it's how I approach my tempo techniques, you know, the opponents that I fight every day and the opponents I fight personally, but that I fight and come alongside with, martial arts can fight depression. It can fight anxiety, it can fight trauma, it can fight all of those things. And oftentimes we get bogged down into who's standing across from us in a ring at a tournament. But if you recognize that your students aren't always gonna wanna be in a tournament, they're not always gonna get into a fight, but they could have something going on you don't know. Then just listening, just showing up and not going, I'm just a karate teacher, not my thing. And I was at a conference once where one of the presenters said, when you're going through school, say hi, and nice to see you. Don't look at someone and say, hi, how are you? Cause then they're gonna answer. And don't say it to every parent because then you're never gonna teach a class. And to me like that hurt a little bit. Like, no, I want them to come talk to me. There are days at my school, I don't leave my office. I have a staff that teaches and I have a revolving door of parents or kids that are just coming in that just need to be heard. And sometimes they need guidance on how to deal with something at school. Hey, I want you to go see this teacher. I want you to go see this guidance counselor, you know. Hey Craig, I don't know how to tell my kid this. Okay, well this would be a good way to go about it. Here's the name of a counselor or therapist that maybe you wanna connect to before you do that. And I help facilitate those things, but parents and kids need to hear it.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
And know that they're being heard and that, you know, Mr. Wharem's love is unconditional. I'm gonna support you. And I'd rather you come and talk to me than feel like you have no one.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And if somebody's listening or watching this and they're thinking, well, you know, that sounds like a lot or not my job or anything like that. I'm not gonna give numbers. Craig's alluded to it. So I think it's fair that I can acknowledge it you know. I do consulting work with you and for your school. I know what the retention numbers are.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And I don't know a school that has better retention. So is that coincidence? I don't think so and I don't think you think so.
Craig Wharem:
No.
Jeremy Lesniak:
So if somebody wants to learn more about MATTC, we've got stuff on the website at whistlekick.com. You can learn more about that. We're working on next iterations for other courses under that training umbrella. And, you know, while the majority of this episode is evergreen and people could listen to it, watch it anytime in the future. We do not currently have hard dates for anything for 2023 for our training, but we will, and you can check the calendar. Or if you wanna host a MATTC session which would be open to your students and other people at your school, we can do that. So get in touch with me, jeremy@whistlekick.com. Now the other piece we should talk about before we wind down here is the awards. You mentioned the awards.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
And I know that that was something that, if I'm remembering correctly, it was, man, I'm really busy, but I'm really passionate about this idea.
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Am I remembering that correctly?
Craig Wharem:
Yeah.
Jeremy Lesniak:
So talk about the awards even though that's, you know, that's Stacy's ball and she's doing a great job keeping it rolling.
Craig Wharem:
She's doing a great job of facilitating you and I at an 8:00 PM Zoom. That's what she's doing a great job at.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yes. That is not an easy thing to do.
Craig Wharem:
No. The awards, very rarely do I get nervous in front of a crowd, right? I have experience teaching solo a hundred seventh grade kids wrist locks, right. And I was not nervous in the least. I was like, this is the coolest chaos I've ever been in. But when I stood up at Free Training Day Northeast and I presented the Flashlight Award which was cool, I felt a connection to all the awards. So I let Stacy pick for me which award was gonna be my kind of baby, right? And she picked a cool one for me. And I was really excited about that. It felt like a big deal because we didn't pick the winner.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Right.
Craig Wharem:
Right? It was voted on and it really...
Jeremy Lesniak:
Anybody who wanted to weigh in.
Craig Wharem:
Anyone could. You didn't even have to necessarily do martial arts in any event, any long-term thing. You could have trained 10 years ago and said, this person made an impact, or I've been training with them for two weeks, this person made an impact. And it was really cool, the process of making it this democratic thing where people get to vote and it's all transparent and you know, all the metrics are right there. And really, truthfully, all the group did was say, this is what we won't feel like we should be recognizing, and then this is how long we're allowed to talk for in front of the microphone. That was it. That was all the group of support, which was really cool and really helpful to me because I was pretty busy, right? Because even though we talk about right now, we talked about MATTC.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
We're talking about the Never Settle Awards. I also don't want it to go by the wayside that I run a school.
Jeremy Lesniak:
Yeah.
Craig Wharem:
Right? Like there's...
Jeremy Lesniak:
It's kinda your job.
Craig Wharem:
Right. There's that whole other piece and that school, it's something I'm incredibly proud of. So on top of doing all the content for MATTC and the other things we were doing to add on something else felt like a lot. And we did it in such a way that it wasn't a lot and I appreciated being a part of that process.
Jeremy Lesniak:
If anybody wants to go deeper on the Never Settle Awards, there is stuff on the website for that as well. I know we could go for hours.
Craig Wharem:
Yes.
Jeremy Lesniak:
This feels like a good break. So if people wanna get ahold of you or check out Karate International and kind of, you know, pick pieces and read between the lines on what you're doing at your school that they might benefit from, what would that be?
Craig Wharem:
Sure. So you can always reach out to me just on Facebook is probably the easiest way. Friend me and you can shoot me messages there. You know, my name will be up there, Craig Wharem. It's easy. Karate International, we can chat anytime about that. And I would love to because what we've done there falls exactly in line with everything we've talked about today. There's a grand vision and it's being accomplished in a way that I don't know anyone else who does it the way we do in the coolest possible way. And if there are people who do it the way I do, I want to know. I wanna meet them, you know? So yeah, definitely reach out and talk to me. I love meeting martial artists. You will definitely, if you wanna see me in person, Free Training Day Northeast. You can also reach out to Jeremy. He knows how to get in touch with me cause I do seminars and things like that. And yeah, I'd love to connect with more people and hear their stories too, because that's what I do.
Jeremy Lesniak:
How do you want to end?
Craig Wharem:
I don't know.
Jeremy Lesniak:
What do you wanna say?
Craig Wharem:
I was getting ready in my head folks, just so you know, because whenever I do an episode with Jeremy and Andrew, I have to do like the sign off thing and in my head I was making sure it was in the right order cause sometimes I goof it up. But no I didn't. I think the best way to wrap up is just to say that, you know, the best days of martial arts I had to follow your instincts and appreciate your journey because the destinations aren't always what you think they're gonna be. And find your spark, find your gift. And let that be what you run with. And if you do that, you're gonna be all right. Everything works out.